Four Link Rear - to Triangulate or not to Triangulate? That is the Question. - Reply to Topic
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Topic Review (Newest First)

  • 07-11-2015, 11:40
    Ian34
    As much as I would like this finished off now, I'm tying my head in knots.
    So I'm going to leave it for a while and await the flash of blindingly obvious.

    I appreciate your input fellas.
  • 07-11-2015, 10:51
    blackpopracing
    You seem to be fixed on using the chassis bracket, make a new one and you should be able to drop the bar forward and down.
  • 07-11-2015, 08:57
    stevieturbo
    Mount the bar slightly forward, and not as high.

    You already have the axle at full compression, so it cannot go any higher, eve it will even go that high in the chassis when driving ? I'd guess not ?

    And whilst it would be best with the bar perpendicular to the vehicle body, it wouldnt be essential if it gained you a bit of clearance to mount the bar lower.

    I'd certainly prefer a slightly angled low mounted bar vs a straight high mounted bar, as roll centre will be much lower with the lower bar

    If you're going to run a really short bar, then I'd nearly consider mounting it off the nose of the diff housing if there are provisions there to fab something up. Again this would let you mount it nice and low
  • 07-11-2015, 00:04
    Ian34
    Right, mocked a couple of options up tonight.

    First the long panhard rod mounted to the four link brackets.
    I like this idea, but because the top four link mounts are so close to the top of the axle, the panhard rod bracket would need to be pretty long to clear the diff.




    So I am favouring the shorter one mounted to the diff casing.
    the bracketry here is mocked up from bits I had lying around, so if I go this way it will be a lot neater.
    The rod itself is 550mm centre to centre. Longer would be nice, but I think this might be OK.



    I have some learned friends coming round soon, so I will probably ponder the alternatives until then.
  • 06-11-2015, 15:54
    choppedblownpop
    Through the years I've tried all sorts of combinations,but my car has now got the "triangulated sliding yoke"
    Even with nearly a yard of rubber on the back,I can honestly say it's never handled so well,and with the level of maintenance
    on mine,I can't see it ever seizing up.
    Attachment 206274

    Really old pic,but you can see what I mean
  • 06-11-2015, 14:36
    Ian34
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpopracing View Post
    I think I understand what you mean, it wont affect it strength wise but you have fairly limited articulation of you mount the rose joint horizontally. If your suspension travel ever exceeds the joint max angle it will damage it or it may possibly break in extreme circumstances.
    Rose joints should always be mounted so the travel is around the ball/bolt not perpendicular to it.

    I'm not a fan of the 4 link wishbone, they can seize if not greased regularly and often can cause conflicting roll centres with 'interesting' handling characteristics. Also know a friend who had one fitted to his pop and it sheared off 6mm plate mounts! caused by it seizing up. He has fitted a panhard rod and is amazed how much nicer it is to drive now.

    This is all you need to make;



    You will need another fillet at the top from the panhard plate to the 4 bar plate (I forgot to draw it)
    I am heading towards something like this to be honest.
    I will eye up the possibilities tonight.

    Thanks to you both for your advise.

    and the CC feature on your Pop looks good Mark.
    Very Cool Car.
  • 06-11-2015, 13:08
    blackpopracing
    I think I understand what you mean, it wont affect it strength wise but you have fairly limited articulation of you mount the rose joint horizontally. If your suspension travel ever exceeds the joint max angle it will damage it or it may possibly break in extreme circumstances.
    Rose joints should always be mounted so the travel is around the ball/bolt not perpendicular to it.

    I'm not a fan of the 4 link wishbone, they can seize if not greased regularly and often can cause conflicting roll centres with 'interesting' handling characteristics. Also know a friend who had one fitted to his pop and it sheared off 6mm plate mounts! caused by it seizing up. He has fitted a panhard rod and is amazed how much nicer it is to drive now.

    This is all you need to make;



    You will need another fillet at the top from the panhard plate to the 4 bar plate (I forgot to draw it)
  • 06-11-2015, 00:03
    stevieturbo
    Other options to consider.

    Google images for these terms.

    triangulated 4 link

    4 link wishbone

    The wishbone option would be a good one and could be done from the rear 4 link upper ( or lower ) mounts to a central point on your crossmember in front of the axle. These allow full axle articulation and provide location.
  • 05-11-2015, 23:40
    Ian34
    I'll mock it up at the workshop tomorrow and post a pic.
  • 05-11-2015, 23:33
    stevieturbo
    I think a diagram would help clarify what were talking about here.

    Clearly the bar itself...ie the threaded section of the rose joints will always either be tension/compression.

    The bolts through the round wobbly bit of the joint would....should always be in shear. That would apply whether the bolts are vertical or horizontal. They'll always be in shear.

    Effectively what you're doing in the photo above is creating a diagonal link. This reduces the axle's ability to articulate, but it a common method for drag cars that only see flat roads and drive in straight lines.
    That said, I did run mine like that for a few months, but never liked the idea of it being there.
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