Moving a Sherpa steering box ? - Reply to Topic
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Topic Review (Newest First)

  • 14-01-2017, 20:02
    cc41memorylane
    No cast steel is fine cast iron is a pain. Drop me a line when you figure out what you need
  • 14-01-2017, 19:00
    stormbird
    Quote Originally Posted by cc41memorylane View Post
    That's what I would do chief. I can make new plate if need be.
    Thanks for the offer , maybe just need tabs welding to existing one especially as the shape is quite complicated with bosses/spacers on chassis side.

    Need to find one of these :-



    There was one of these on my Sherpa connecting steering box to column.

    I realised if I can find one more it will fit my splines and one end is ideal for inserting a length of tubing into , although they appear to be cast ? which could make welding difficult ?

    regards Paul
  • 14-01-2017, 18:20
    cc41memorylane
    That's what I would do chief. I can make new plate if need be.
  • 14-01-2017, 18:15
    stormbird
    Quote Originally Posted by kapri View Post
    Ther is also a physics based limit on how far your u/js will go before creating ind. In my min dteh best solution here is to firstly ensure you can remove the pitman arm and reposition through 90' . The redrill the box mounting plate to lay the steering wheel to shaft just above teh chassis rail.
    Kapri and others who asked ?

    The steering box has 3 bolts holding it to a 10mm ish plate that has 4 bolts holding it to the chassis.

    So the plate can stay as it is so I don't have to alter the chassis keeping some of my 8 points.






    So if I undo the 3 bolts and rotate the steering box I can weld 3 tabs to the plate and reposition the bolts thus lowering the steering shaft if I need to.

    regards Paul
  • 13-01-2017, 19:15
    28Chevy
    Also notice the vertical king pins, no self entering at all, so if it bump steers off line they have to manually turn it back and possibly over compensate a little, a recipe for fishtailing.

    Add skinny cross plies on dirt roads into the mix and you really have to wonder at their sanity taking it anywhere near the speeds it was capable of !

    Bernard
  • 13-01-2017, 18:53
    stormbird
    Quote Originally Posted by 28Chevy View Post
    Just remembered a vid I shot last year, look at what must be the ultimate miss-matched steering arcs ever seen on a vintage racer

    But those guys ain't scared one tiddy little bit

    I reckon the secret to it's driveability is a very flat stiff spring so it's length hardly ever changes.

    https://youtu.be/q0I8-e6As64
    Lovely of course there are few bumps on a race track

    Great shot where he has his foot on the spare wheel , I reckon though I will have a bit more bodywork than that style so not possible for me.



    Just for reference if you decide to go that way I took a pic of my Chevy, I thought the box was nearer the shackle it but it doesn't look too far off what you had mocked up with the ply bracket.

    Attachment 251513

    So if you decide on that option it may not be any worse than mine so too bad after all, although your single leaf spring will move much more.

    Bernard
    Thanks for taking the trouble to photograph this , as you say close to what I wanted to do.

    The current steering box is inside the spring pivot at the front , however I can't achieve that if I move it to behind the axle as it would have to be mounted below the chassis and would interfere with the spring , so it would have to be behind the spring shackle if moved to the rear.

    Your description of the Chevy was very comprehensive and gave a great insight into car handling pre WW2 , I certainly want to capture the looks of the 1910's sort of pre-Blower Bentley however I don't 'need' to degrade the Sherpa handling to that extent.

    Although in all honesty the Sherpa is very 1950's in execution despite being designed in the 70's !

    regards Paul
  • 13-01-2017, 18:28
    28Chevy
    Just remembered a vid I shot last year, look at what must be the ultimate miss-matched steering arcs ever seen on a vintage racer

    But those guys ain't scared one tiddy little bit

    I reckon the secret to it's driveability is a very flat stiff spring so it's length hardly ever changes.

    https://youtu.be/q0I8-e6As64

    Just for reference if you decide to go that way I took a pic of my Chevy, I thought the box was nearer the shackle it but it doesn't look too far off what you had mocked up with the ply bracket.

    Attachment 251513

    So if you decide on that option it may not be any worse than mine so too bad after all, although your single leaf spring will move much more.

    Bernard
  • 12-01-2017, 21:50
    stormbird
    bernard & brading

    thanks for your input much appreciated

    think the next thing to do is mock-up a cockpit with some OSB board and the seats I hope to use to see where the steering column ends up and get one of those steering couplings locally and see if it can all be made to work

    regards Paul
  • 12-01-2017, 19:43
    brading
    As the tie rods do not need ball joints at the idler arm ends just bearings thought this might work. Obviously you would have to check on tyre clearance on lock.

  • 12-01-2017, 17:49
    28Chevy
    Getting things into perspective may help.

    A lot of pre-war cars had steering with the box behind the swinging shackle, my Chevy is like that but the link is shorter, it has bump steer when hitting a pot hole, speed bump or unevenness in the road.

    It's just how things where back then when speeds where much slower and there was room on the road to wander!

    However for most of the time it's fine as the slack in the steering box (about an inch at the steering wheel rim) takes out any kickback I would otherwise feel.

    What you're doing with a longer link would worsen the effect beyond that which you might find acceptable even if you are used to pre-war standards, a driver who has only driven modern rack steered cars would find it awful.

    Adding a power steering box would act as a damper, and as suggested a shorter link with an idler may help.

    Ideally you would be better to leave the box as original (rotating it as suggested would help) as the arcs are better and avoid any 8 point probs, but even the original arcs won't be perfect at every position, it's all a compromise after all.

    PS. early jeeps had the swinging shackle at the front, presumably because the bump steer was just too much due to the extreme axle travel off road.

    Bernard
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