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I’d have thought it’ll be fine without a slipper, as all the pivot points match the lower 4 bar mounts so can’t see how the length of arcs can be at odds with each other.
I had something similar on my 123e, but in fairness that only had about 2” of travel so didn’t ever have enough travel to show up ant problems :)

Chaley
 
Definitely wont be fine Chaley, if axle raises & falls equally it's fine, lift one side & drop the other (you wont be able to) then the triangle sides need to change length - but they can't without the slipper joint. Results are either: broken rose joint at chassis end, broken bracket at chassis end or broken rose joints at axle ends.

The issue is the axle rotates around the centre point between the 4 bars whereas the locator rotates around the lower fixing of the 4 bars. Two different axis of rotation fighting against each other.
 
The issue is the axle rotates around the centre point between the 4 bars whereas the locator rotates around the lower fixing of the 4 bars. Two different axis of rotation fighting against each other.
So if you raised the whole wishbone so that it aligned with the axle's axis of rotation it would be OK? (Except that it would probably end up fouling the propshaft!)
 
Discussion starter · #927 ·
Hi Guys.

Just read the comments regarding my "track locator" . Firstly I am the first to admit I'm no suspension engineer :tdown:
But... when this idea was put to me I needed to see that other hot rods have and were using this set up .

One very well respected hot rod builder and very clever man has this set up on his own car also a very well know hot rod business has also used this very same set up on "customer " cars . So I was sold !!!!

I also realise that I'm not building a car to blast around the forests of Wales or like wise to race around Brands Hatch .

It's a HOT ROD !!!!!!!!!!!!!. ( remember the 70s/80s when guys bolted /welded superglued Jag IRS to the back of their Pop ,Escort etc)they were't interested in handling .......it just had to look good .Thankfully we have moved on from there :tup::tup:

Back to mine truck , The whole assembly was tacked together to check to see if there were any flaws in the design ( DID IT WORK ????).
Yes it worked , it worked fantastically well .With the bags removed and a scissor jack under the diff I was able the move the axle up and down equally then I pivoted the axle ( at different heights) to replicate roll . The amount of travel ( without the bags ) was from 0/320mm , a massive roll it will never ever be that much . Don't forget it is still only tacked together , I then clamped pieces of box section at intervals across the track locator to see if there was any torsional strain along the tubing . There was no hint of movement .
I then put the axle at ride height and pivoted the axle trying to replicate " normal " driving ( upward travel with one wheel dropping into a pot hole etc ). I have approx 150mm of travel , far more than most hot rods !!.


So as I said it might not be the suspension engineers dream set up but it works on my truck .
I then fully welded the whole assembly together it did the same checks .To say " IT WILL BREAK " I'm not so sure !!!!!!!!!!!!.
I could have used a " Johnny Joint " for the front pivot but the amount of miles the truck is likely to do , I'm happy with my version .

Unless I have made something " unsafe " I will be keeping this set up .When its finally on the road it will be constantly monitored ,if it doesn't work or has undue characteristics I will change IT .
Thanks again guys .
 
hi mark

anything can break.diagonal location bars as supposed to break and be a no no on the street,but they work under tens of thousands of cars driven on the street.

track locators seam to be the same.ive done a couple and made them with the slip joint,but these are drag cars,where the rear can really twist violently.

if you've cycled it and nothing binds,thats all the answers you need.

what everyone seams to over look in discussions like this is rose joints. rose joints fail.if there not covered and protected,they can lock solid.

ive seen some corkers through here.4 bar rear end.all rose joints.every one has seized,so one snapped.even funnier was they welded it back on and kept using the car.

johnny joints are superb.i use them in higher end builds here.
 
Mark, Well if you have checked it twists without binding then all is ok :)

Wayne, track locators will break, but only after a certain amount of time/fatigue. The thicker the mount/size of rose joint will dictate how long before it breaks, most rods are not driven enough to get to the fatigue point. I have seen quite a few broken ones though, also seen a few slip joint ones ripped out of chassis - but this is because the slip joint had seized.

Johnny joints look really good - would they retro fit in a std Urethane mount (IE could you undo the urethane rod end & just wind in a Johhny joint & bolt it back up).
 
Discussion starter · #930 ·
Hi Guys , I really appreciate the imput Ref ... my track locator . All I can do is monitor it to check on binding ,fatigue etc . As I mentioned before if I thought this was unsafe etc I would not have continued with it . Thanks again .:tup::tup:

Next task was to make a new rear cross member .....why ???????. I had only ever tacked a piece of 4x2 box section in place but as things have changed and evolved with the truck bed that box section wouldn't work.
The main reason that it wouldn't work is that as the bed gets fitted on to the chassis because of the curved shapes that go under the cab
its a pig to get it under the cab and over the ends of the chassis . In an ideal world the bed should be fitted before the cab but on final fit this is not practical .
So the best way over this is to cut 100mm off of the chassis legs and make a new rear cross member with a removable mount for the truck bed . This mount can be easily fitted when the truck bed is positioned over the chassis rails . Hopefully the pics will explain better than me ,:tup:

Rear cross member.



Rear cross member welded in .It was shaped to match the exhaust outlet shape in the centre of the truck bed.


Next the removable truck bed mount.




The next task ( which i had been dreading ) was to make a grille !!!!!!. Because the bonnet an pretty much everything has been modified .I couldn't buy a grille from the states , so have had to make one :tdown:
I had some profiles laser cut from my patterns but untill I started I was unsure how much modifacation I would have to do to the profiles. I also knew that I would have to cut my own pieces as it progressed !!!!.
A pile of grille bar profiles.



So this is the start of mocking up the grille.



I cut a lower mount from 3mm s/s which helps hold the grille shell a little more rigid as I try and get things to fit .
I cut the top section from the same s/s but in two pieces ( I forgot to take a pic of them before they were welded together but the cardboard shows the shape I started with.






Next task is to make some mounts for the grille shell then move onto the grille bars.
 
Discussion starter · #931 ·
Back again :tup:
As I mentioned before ,I wasn't looking forward to this job . It really has turned into a total pain!!!!!!!!. I have made up a mount for the bottom of the grille shell and the top is mounted to the slam panel via 2x m8 cap heads sunk into the holes on the top of the grille shell .
I will have to modify the slam panel but it's not a big job .
I then made up some mounts for the grille bars ..... cutting and mounting the grille bars has taken so long :tdown::tdown: I hope I don't have to do it again .
Here are a few pics of progress so far . The grille shell has had one polish just to make sure all the welds have disappeared .







 
Mark, this build has been on another level since the start, and this grille is simply the crowning glory.
I look forward to every installment, as it shows just what is possible with time and a talent that us mortals can only dream of.
Keep up the good work, this is setting the bar somewhere in the stratosphere!
 
Discussion starter · #939 ·
Hi Guys , I hope you are all well and keeping busy .:tup:
THANK YOU SO MUCH for the great comments I really do appreciate them :rule::rule:

I have been trying to keep myself busy and decided to tackle the odd jobs I had been putting off .
Firstly I had to finish the grille .I needed to make a mount for the top of the grille , this turned into a bigger job than I thought .
Looking through the grille there was a large gap between the rad and the slam panel so I made up a closing piece for this ( the same curve as the header tank) which allowed me to bolt a bracket to this, which the grille bolts to . I have built in some captive nuts to allow a little adjustment to the grille .





Modified slam panel


The next task was to finish off the inside of the truck bed , I always wanted to keep the access holes in the bed sides for running cables and cavity waxing etc .I also wanted any panels I made to be body worked to match the rest of the bed.I decided to fit them with m6 cap head bolts recessed into each panel .The only trouble was that the best looking position for the bolts meant the bolts floated in fresh air as there was no body work behind each bolt to screw them into !!!!!!!!.
So the first job was to make the five panels then recess the cap heads and make some mounts .
A pic of all the panels and the mounts ( the mounts are in stainless so that I don't have worry about them again )

Then some pics of the panels fitted , there is still a bit of fine tuning to do but the worst bit is over !!.



Now a task that I really hadn't been able to make a decision about , the SEAT BELTS or rather how they come through the interior body work I built . So this is what I made .
I needed to get the seat belt buckle through the body work ( which needs quite a large hole but once through I needed to cover this hole but allowing the seat belt to rub on something smooth and not snag .
A long time ago I bought an old rotary table for the mill ( never used one before ) so I thought I would give it a go . I cut some stainless down to a rough size then milled it to my dimensions and then milled a radius on each end .




I then machined a slot in the middle for the seat belt to pass through , then welded some m6 studs to the back . After a bit of metal finishing I gave them a quick polish . I will modify the bodywork with a new mounting plate for them .



 
I have just spent a pleasant few days reading through this thread from day 1 and words have completely failed me!
The skill and vision levels involved to produce metalwork like that are out of this world, it is nothing short of pure art!

Thank you for the inspiration and the kick up the backside to try to raise my game, a bracket doesn’t have to be just a bracket, it can look good too.
All of the superlatives have been used up and rightfully so in which case I will just leave a simple thank you for sharing your build and for inspiring so many builders :smoke:
 
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