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Bad day at the office ? :pmsl:
it wasn't mate, this shit just grinds you down !!!!

have been reading the thread on R/R regards andy saunders car - what a total fucking farce - the dvla/vosa etc are THE comedy horse - the head dont know what the arse is doing !! and these pricks (that know fuck all) are (seemingly) just making it up as they go along,

i think iv just about had enough of it all :(
 

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Cadillac fanatic
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Politics......... sound just like what is is... BOLLOCKS

I say fuck them, who gives a shit how loud your pipes are, what a crock of shit.

When you have planes flying over your head and roadworks drilling holes everywhere creating traffic and making such a poxy din, these people need to get a fucking life.

VOSA... is that german for :wanker:
 

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Thats proper police work again,easy money, dont worry about all the rapes, mugging,mobile phone users,etc etc etc dont get me started......................on t v the other morning there looking at given you 1 point on your licence if you drop litter out of your car !!!!!
 

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So what about all these supercars that have flaps in the exhausts? I was near a Ferarri that opened it up in town and it went from quiet and silenced to race car mode and it was one million angry wasps in a metal bucket horrible deafening. Lambos, Audis and Mercs do the same.
 

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Dragging not Bragging
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Am i reading it wrong :beuj: or is it just me reading between the lines :tup:

Modifying a vehicles exhaust beyond the 'standard' EU limits and Producing excessive noise.

Well im ok then, my exhaust isnt a modified one but a one off so there is no set standard :tup:
 

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Has anyone got access to a copy of ISO 5130:2007 cos it says in this abstract that it does not specify a method for comparing reading to a standard limit.

ISO 5130:2007 specifies a test procedure, environment and instrumentation for measuring the exterior sound pressure levels from road vehicles under stationary condition, providing a continuous measure of the sound pressure level over a range of engine speeds. ISO 5130:2007 applies only to road vehicles of categories L, M and N equipped with internal combustion engines.

ISO 5130:2007 is designed to meet the requirements of simplicity as far as they are consistent with reproducibility of results under the operating conditions of the vehicle.

It is within the scope of ISO 5130:2007 to measure the stationary A-weighted sound pressure level during type approval measurements of vehicle, measurements at the manufacturing stage, measurements at official testing stations and measurements at roadside testing. Technical background information is provided.

ISO 5130:2007 specifies neither a method to check the exhaust sound pressure level when the engine is operated at realistic load nor a method to check the exhaust sound pressure levels against a general noise limit for categories of road vehicles.
 

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Never confused
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So does this mean that ALL 50cc Scooters will be banned as they are ALL way to loud.
Are they going to ban ALL supercars.
Are they going to make it illegal for that spotty little know nothing cock working in Halfords to sell a " WOOOOOMER " silencer to the Saxo boys.

That'll be interesting when my J tubed unsilenced zoomie style exhaust is hanging out the back of my Karmann Ghia ( mind you, hover cars will be out by time my Ghia's done ).

:wanker:
 

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Mr Invisible
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The problem they have, as Sgt Keenan said to me, is that there is infact no general, legal 'upper level' for exhaust noise in vehicles.
So they use the EU figure for 'performance exhausts' which is 89db and prosecute under the 'Modifying a vehicle's exhaust to produce extra noise' legislation, because the standard exhaust would not have exceeded that level.
Where you have a vehicle that has undergone SVA there are defined levels for exhaust noise and that is with a 'standard' exhaust fitted to the 'One-off vehicle that is going through the test, so it's not a modified exhaust.
A 'mass produced car will have been 'Type Approved' with a lower exhaust dB level.

Sgt Keenan did say that this was not an attempt to get modified vehicles off the road, it was more of an education thing, both for the drivers and the complainants.
For instance, if a complaint is made about a vehicle and, on testing it is proved to be within the levels the results will be shown to the complainant.
Also it's a question of anti social behaviour.
As he said, if you have a performance exhaust and you drive reasonably, then no one will complain.
 

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Mr Invisible
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So what about all these supercars that have flaps in the exhausts? I was near a Ferarri that opened it up in town and it went from quiet and silenced to race car mode and it was one million angry wasps in a metal bucket horrible deafening. Lambos, Audis and Mercs do the same.
You'd probably be surprised as to how 'quiet; in terms of dB levels they are..
Even the 'Vettes at Le Mans this year were only running around 102-105 dB.

The Lola Astons were under 100dB

This site give a few interesting numbers
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/TableOfSoundPressureLevels.htm
 

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Am i reading it wrong :beuj: or is it just me reading between the lines :tup:

Modifying a vehicles exhaust beyond the 'standard' EU limits and Producing excessive noise.

Well im ok then, my exhaust isnt a modified one but a one off so there is no set standard :tup:
im in the same boat, or should that be gasser??,,,,,as you :D
 

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Mr Invisible
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Am i reading it wrong :beuj: or is it just me reading between the lines :tup:

Modifying a vehicles exhaust beyond the 'standard' EU limits and Producing excessive noise.

Well im ok then, my exhaust isnt a modified one but a one off so there is no set standard :tup:
Yup, then you only have to look out for the 'Excess noise' side of things.
This is at the officer's discretion and. so lonmg as it doesn't sound like most hot hatches, they don't care.
A loud V8 has a completely different, and less annoying, tone than a straight 4 with a 5 inch back box, which is really what D&C are after.
 

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Sgt Keenan did say ...[].that if you have a performance exhaust and you drive reasonably, then no one will complain.
Sounds like the thin end of the wedge to me. I have not, in the last 15years at least, seen the police take 'a view' when a NIP is avialable.

From what I read it looks as though this could only be applied to cars that have passed Eu WVTA (Type Approval) and even then it looks like a very shaky grounds for prosecution if contested in court. Most cars on here are not wvta as they are a) too old , b) imported etc etc.

Would be really interested to see if they could get this to stand up in court.
 

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Mr Invisible
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Sounds like the thin end of the wedge to me. I have not, in the last 15years at least, seen the police take 'a view' when a NIP is avialable.

From what I read it looks as though this could only be applied to cars that have passed Eu WVTA (Type Approval) and even then it looks like a very shaky grounds for prosecution if contested in court. Most cars on here are not wvta as they are a) too old , b) imported etc etc.

Would be really interested to see if they could get this to stand up in court.
Another of the things that the Sgt Keenan said is that this process is not designed to lead to formal court procedings and that the evidence of the meters is not enough 'on it's own' to generate a court case.

Where such evidence could/would be used would be in an antisociasl behaviour prosecution where the detail of readings would be used as a guide to the court, but would not be used as 'evidence'.

Again, this is pointing towards the Hot-Hatch 'Cruzin' boys.
 

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Another of the things that the Sgt Keenan said is that this process is not designed to lead to formal court procedings and that the evidence of the meters is not enough 'on it's own' to generate a court case.

Where such evidence could/would be used would be in an antisociasl behaviour prosecution where the detail of readings would be used as a guide to the court, but would not be used as 'evidence'.

Again, this is pointing towards the Hot-Hatch 'Cruzin' boys.
Sounds like things are getting a little confused.

It says in the original link by Kapri, that they will consider prosecution at a level above 90 dB, but the ISO does not lay down a test procedure for measuring compliance with a standard, and they are now saying that it is just a guide, and it is down to the officers view of the noise.

As far as I can see the readings are taken with an A weighting, which makes the level more in line with how the human ear hears noise. If that is the case then all of the readings in the report should say dB (A) and not dB which is completely different.
 

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Mr Invisible
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Sounds like things are getting a little confused.

It says in the original link by Kapri, that they will consider prosecution at a level above 90 dB, but the ISO does not lay down a test procedure for measuring compliance with a standard, and they are now saying that it is just a guide, and it is down to the officers view of the noise.

As far as I can see the readings are taken with an A weighting, which makes the level more in line with how the human ear hears noise. If that is the case then all of the readings in the report should say dB (A) and not dB which is completely different.
As I said in the article, there are two different offences here.

One is Modifying an exhaust to produce excessive noise, whcih is where they rely on the measuring devices.
The other is 'Excessive noise' which does not require measurments other than the officer's opinion.

If they measure at 90db, they will consider prosecution on the 'Modifying an exhaust' option.
If they measure and they do not hit 90 they will not prosecute on that legislation. However, they may consider prosecuting on the 'Excessive noise' legislation, which does not require the dB level to be above 89. This is completely at the discretion of the officer. If he thinks your exhaust is too loud then it's too loud period and he will prosecute.

The testing is not done to compare the dB of the exhaust against a 'Standard', the only 'Stabnard' here is the EU regs for a Type Approved replacement exhaust of the kind you can buy from Halfords etc, which must not exceed 89dB. That's where that number comes from.
The testing is carried out following the procedures laid down in ISO 5130.

On the subject of dB vs dB(a), as a mere support desk analyst I wouldn't know the difference and can only type what I see.
If there is a difference then I stand corrected.
 

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So in effect for most of the cars owned by people on here, there will be no change.

They will still not be able to make excessive noise according to the opinion of a police officer.

I think it likely that officers will be visiting gatherings of potentially loud vehicles and trying to suggest that the modified exhaust level of 89 dB ( as they put it ) is what is considered acceptable in all cases.

Is it likely that officers will be encouraged to think that anything above this level is not acceptable under the "excessive noise legislation"?
 

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Mr Invisible
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So in effect for most of the cars owned by people on here, there will be no change.

They will still not be able to make excessive noise according to the opinion of a police officer.

I think it likely that officers will be visiting gatherings of potentially loud vehicles and trying to suggest that the modified exhaust level of 89 dB ( as they put it ) is what is considered acceptable in all cases.

Is it likely that officers will be encouraged to think that anything above this level is not acceptable under the "excessive noise legislation"?
The legislation has always been there.
the police can, should they choose to pull anyone for 'Excessive' noise and that has always been at the discretion of the BiB.
The only difference here is that D&C are taking a reasoned approach to things by using the noismetres to show the 'acrtual' level of the noise that people are complaining about.
And conversly, to show that the vehicle that is being complained about is not 'over the limit'
This is not something that they will be doing on a random basis as the roadside test can take considerable time to complete.
Again, looking between the lines it's the 'boom boys' they are after.
exactly the ones that everone complains about on boards like this and the NSRA.
 
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